EMDR Remedy and Psychological Well being Assist with Susie Morgan, LMFT, BCETS

Betty Rocker (00:15):

What’s up, Rockstars Coach Betty Rocker right here, and I’m actually glad you’re right here too. Sooner or later, you might have heard me discuss a sort of remedy that I used known as EMDR, which stands for Eye Motion Desensitization and Reprocessing. And it’s actually recognized for its capacity to deal with PTSD and traumatic occasions. There’s numerous totally different sorts of therapeutic practices on the market, and in the case of our psychological well being, it’s actually essential to discover a good match and the proper instruments for addressing our particular person considerations so we are able to stay extra full and significant lives. After going by way of a extremely tough interval of my very own life and being recognized with anxiousness and despair, one of many suggestions I used to be given was to hunt EMDR therapy.

(01:02)
I’ll share a bit extra about my expertise with it on the present immediately as a result of the individual I’ve introduced to speak to us is the superb therapist I labored with, and I’m actually excited so that you can meet her. She actually helped me change my mind and my life. Susie Morgan is a licensed marriage and household therapist, board licensed professional in trauma stress, and a licensed EMDR therapist specializing within the therapy of advanced PTSD and attachment trauma. Along with her observe, she’s additionally an E-M-D-R-I-A permitted guide and coach, and the founding father of the Precision EMDR Academy, a boutique coaching company that equips and mentors clinicians to offer secure and efficient EMDR remedy. She is devoted to offering each a excessive degree of care in her personal therapeutic observe and advancing the excellence within the area of EMDR. I felt that she was uniquely outfitted to share extra about EMDR with us and provide you with a way of what it’s used for, who may profit from it, and what sort of issues it treats, and the right way to discover and vet an excellent practitioner. So be a part of me in welcoming her to the present. Welcome, Susie. It’s so nice to have you ever right here with me. Thanks a lot for being right here.

Susie Morgan (02:22):

Thanks for having me. That is completely my honor, so thanks.

Betty Rocker (02:26):

Oh my gosh. Nicely, I’ve been so excited to have a dialog about EMDR so that individuals would find out about it, individuals who’ve perhaps heard about it could get extra aware of it, as a result of I really feel prefer it’s type of, it’s a more moderen observe in the case of the therapeutic arts within the better scheme of remedy. Is that appropriate?

Susie Morgan (02:51):

Sure and no, as a result of that’s somewhat little bit of a false impression as a result of it’s actually been round since 1987. And so what meaning is that although it’s not as outdated as clearly like Freudian remedy and people actually conventional fashions or cognitive behavioral, it, it isn’t new. And so it’s, it truly has had loads of time to really develop out an extremely strong, like encyclopedia of analysis, not solely exhibiting that it treats PTSD, but in addition a variety of different problems that individuals can current with. And so it’s truly a false impression that it’s new, it’s simply newer that individuals learn about it and

Betty Rocker (03:34):

Newer that individuals learn about it. Nicely, would perhaps, like I ought to ask the primary query, which is, what does EMDR stand for and what does it particularly deal with? As a result of I feel that’s actually attention-grabbing. It’s, it’s very distinctive within the therapeutic arts.

Susie Morgan (03:50):

Okay. So the, the inventor of EMDR would’ve renamed it. She mentioned if she had had an opportunity, however by the point it was extra well-known and being researched, she was like, okay, that is what it’s known as. So it stands for eye motion desensitization and reprocessing. And so let me break that down. So it makes use of eye motion. Historically, you need to use different means to permit for the, the mind to mainly replicate what occurs throughout REM sleep, we expect with a view to truly reconsolidate recollections. And so you need to use different duties, different bilateral forms of motion with, with tactile and even tones with a view to create this impact. In order that’s the attention motion a part of it. It’s utilizing this particular bilateral, units of actions with a view to stimulate the mind to enter right into a reminiscence reconsolidation mode. After which the desensitization and reprocessing are the 2 issues that it’s doing.

(04:53)
What it’s doing is it’s taking the activation of those recollections and desensitizing that. So taking, taking the cost out of it, taking that chew out of the reminiscence, after which it’s reprocessing it. So it’s truly connecting it as much as adaptive data and adaptive data. Is that this actuality based mostly or soothing or, optimistic data that claims it’s over and actually undoes the training and connects it as much as what truly the mind already is aware of. However when a reminiscence is maladaptively saved, it doesn’t absorb the entire context of issues. It doesn’t absorb the truth that issues are over or that the truth is, although it’s true, prefer it doesn’t really feel true. So it it, it connects all that up.

Betty Rocker (05:39):

What’s the eye motion a part of eye motion desensitization reprocessing? Is your eye simply going forwards and backwards otherwise you snapping your fingers? What’s occurring? Is there lights?

Susie Morgan (05:49):

So through the years, devices have been invented and since mainly the secret is you are attempting to have that shopper’s eyes trip throughout the sphere division as quickly as they’ll bodily tolerate whereas holding the reminiscence materials in thoughts. And so you’ll be able to have somebody, holding a, , a set of buzzers of their palms that gentle up they usually can look forwards and backwards between the lights. The buzzing can also be another that permits there to be a tactile degree of stimulation for that forwards and backwards in order that, individuals who can’t use their eyes for this course of truly can have an efficient type of bilateral stimulation. There are eye, like, like eye motion machines the place mainly you’ll be able to, you’ll be able to comply with a lightweight bar forwards and backwards, or there’s like these bins you’ll be able to maintain that may trigger your lights to return, trigger your eyes to trip as you comply with the lights.

(06:49)
There are laptop applications which have somewhat bouncing ball that trip, however backside line is you don’t want machines. You simply want some mechanism for eyes to trip. So I do, I do EMDR on-line on a regular basis now with none equipment in anyway, with none particular applications. I simply have individuals pinching their fingers forwards and backwards with their eyes held a couple of shoulder width aside. They comply with their very own pinches, and that produces the efficient eye motion. However mainly what we’ve proven in analysis is that eye motion is the simplest method to create the reminiscence reconsolidation course of that we’re on the lookout for. Nevertheless, these different strategies tactile and, an auditory can produce an identical degree, however there does appear to be greater than, extra at play than simply that your eyes are going forwards and backwards. There may be, there’s the chance that that’s, activating a rem like mechanism of sleep.

(07:48)
We see chemical, chemical, related chemical substances produced within the mind, related brainwaves. It additionally seems that work taxing working reminiscence is among the the reason why it’s efficient. It’s not as snug, it’s not as enjoyable to have to really like, like do a flowery patterning together with your fingers whilst you have the buzzing or matching your eye actions together with your pinches. However that truly causes the tough reminiscence materials to metabolize sooner. However when you overtax working reminiscence, you lower on that reprocessing portion. So it’s, there’s type of a candy spot, and it’s totally different for every individual on how a lot, how onerous we wish them to work whereas they’re doing the bilateral processing.

Betty Rocker (08:35):

What’s a, what’s an excellent instance of a maladaptive reminiscence that somebody may need that was not connecting? Proper? Or what occurs in, in remedy?

Susie Morgan (08:46):

So an instance of a, a trauma reminiscence can be a canine chew. So somewhat lady, she’s in her entrance yard, A canine comes by, bites her. There’s two methods the mind can go together with that. One we might name maladaptive. One we might name adaptive. And so it, it, and the distinction is how does the reminiscence find yourself being saved by the mind, which components of the mind are concerned? And so if it’s maladaptively saved, it will get at, it will get saved in nearly like this unique kind. Like all the, the visible sight sounds feels of that second are identical to encapsulated in time. And so she might be 30 years outdated and it feels prefer it occurred yesterday when she thinks of it. So it, it shops sizzling within the visible cortex of the mind, the emotional cortex of the mind. And the attention-grabbing factor is the logical components of the mind that claims it’s over, you’re secure now. That type of factor. The, that complete piece of the mind doesn’t even come on-line. So it’s all sight sounds, feels, and feelings, and it’s sizzling and it’s saved that method quite than it’s over, I’m secure. It occurred a very long time in the past. Now I do know that, , it’s best to, , type of just be sure you don’t simply pet a canine. You don’t know , that type of factor,

Betty Rocker (10:10):

Proper? So, so the expertise that an individual would have who had these two totally different storages of the reminiscence is one little lady could be afraid of canine perpetually as a result of that reminiscence’s all the time burning vivid and burning sizzling with all of that saved stuff the place the opposite little lady who’s,  it’s not saved in a adverse method. She simply is extra cautious in approaching canine the place the opposite lady could be afraid to strategy a canine in that sense. Yeah. So the, the trauma impacts how we behave in several methods shifting ahead is what you’re saying

Susie Morgan (10:40):

In that type of adaptive versus maladaptive piece. Adaptive is, I’m secure now on a really primary degree and I can preserve myself secure now, or it’s, I’m not secure. And so the physique goes in a combat or flight, if something reminds the nervous system of that incident. And there’s truly three forms of trauma I consider that actually, actually matter. And so it’s very a lot increasing out the definition of the phrase in a, in a method that I feel is essential as a result of there’s so many individuals who say, effectively, I don’t have trauma. I wasn’t at battle, I wasn’t assaulted, that type of factor. So, so EMDR remedy isn’t for me or pondering of myself as having trauma that I would want to reprocess by way of that could possibly be affecting my signs.  That simply doesn’t, that simply doesn’t come of their conceptualization

Betty Rocker (11:30):

Positive.

Susie Morgan (11:31):

Of what they’re coping with, and subsequently it stops them from getting assist they might get. So the three forms of trauma that I feel are actually essential to know are that massive T trauma. In order that’s classically what we perceive as, yeah, blood hearth battle assault, that’s what that’s conceptualized as. Then you might have, little t traumas or what are opposed life occasions. And these are issues that typically individuals, , another person may have a look at that and be like, effectively, that’s no massive deal. So that is like bullying. Or it’s issues like, , somebody, somebody being a jerk at work or somebody calling you a reputation on the playground or your sister leaving you out, like that type of factor. So, so these are your little, little to your opposed life occasions. However truly what’s much more crucial, I feel, is knowing advanced with advanced, developmental trauma, which is extra widespread than you may assume, is when early attachment wants aren’t met.

(12:32)
And, or then if there’s additionally some abuse or issues like that in these early years that it, that’s actually truly what can create the longest and most pervasive points with anxiousness, despair, all kinds of issues that we simply consider like, oh, these are psychological well being points, when truly, if we return, we’re wanting on the absence of attunement and even the absence of play, which is attention-grabbing. The absence of safety. This, , simply not having the steering you want, like the right way to shave your legs, the right way to take care of a, a bully peer. Like all of those totally different items actually make a distinction within the capacity of that individual’s nervous system to face up to the stressors that may come. And so oftentimes when these type of developmental early attachment wants aren’t met, then you might have extra of a, of a susceptibility for the mind to maladaptively maintain these later occasions. So it’s, it’s actually difficult.

Betty Rocker (13:38):

Nicely, not, I feel you defined it fantastically in order that the three varieties, there’s the large Ts, there’s the, the little ts, that are, what did you name them? Adversarial occasions. After which there’s additionally the attachment points. And, and attachment principle is completely fascinating. I keep in mind that you beneficial the guide hooked up to me years in the past, and it was so useful in a, a, giving me a framework of understanding the distinction between the, anxious avoidant and the safe attachment kinds, that are these three attachment kinds. And simply saying them, it, it makes a lot sense why anxious and avoidant can be so polarized when you guys take into consideration that. It’s so fascinating. After which how will we create safety, proper? And, and totally different facets of our life. However, that was, that was actually attention-grabbing that that comes into play in, in what’s handled throughout the scope of EMDR. We wanna discuss somewhat bit extra about that. ’trigger I feel that’s so attention-grabbing.

Susie Morgan (14:41):

Yeah, I’d like to as a result of it’s, it’s a lot what is available in to the workplace when individuals are saying, my relationships are simply not working mm-hmm . Or I preserve stepping into the identical sort of type of damaging dynamic with my companions. Mm. And so, so what occurs when these early attachment wants aren’t met is somewhat nervous system is so sensible and so clever to type of learn the room of the connection with their caregivers, they usually truly can learn the room in another way with totally different caregivers relying on what, what can be only for his or her must be met. And, and to contextualize this, little mammals can’t survive with out their caregivers attunement to them or their, not attunement, however with out them assembly their wants. Mainly. Like little mammals die if their caregiver type of leaves them by the aspect of the highway with out issues. And so people are not any totally different.

(15:40)
And so an toddler or a toddler or issues like that may notice if I cry extra, you come, if I cry much less, you don’t get so mad at me. That type of factor. Mm-hmm. And so what finally ends up occurring if you simply have a look at anxious versus avoidant anxious is, I cry extra, you’ll come mm-hmm. Avoidant is, I cry much less, I’m extra prone to get my wants met, I’m safer right here. After which you might have these very unhappy conditions the place the, the early atmosphere is so harsh and is so each neglectful of those attachment wants in addition to damaging by way of abuse or issues like that, that the nervous system will be taught. Like, okay, generally I cry louder, generally I shut down. Prefer it’s this complete like, like dance of simply to attempt to get wants met in no matter little tiny method that they’ll. And the factor is, as soon as the mind locks in on this stuff, identical to trauma recollections, as soon as the mind locks in on these attachments methods or these diversifications to their en their early atmosphere ring retains doing the identical factor over and over and over, whether or not or not the atmosphere modifications.

(16:49)
And finally the saddest half that I see in my, in my workplace is little nervous methods as they develop up, select most naturally what looks like residence. And they also’ll repeat what they, they went by way of once they had been small, pondering they’re doing one thing totally different, however then touchdown in the identical sort of of relationship. After which, after which concluding, I’m the issue. It’s as a result of I’m nugatory, I’m unlovable, or regardless of the case could be. When finally, like that’s not the case. It’s actually simply that their nervous system doesn’t know the right way to do one thing totally different. In order that’s the actually cool stuff we are able to do with superior expertise with EMDR remedy isn’t just resolve these recollections. Like we don’t simply reprocess recollections. We truly can truly restore and restore the attachment system. So it’s, it’s fairly magic what’s potential and

Betty Rocker (17:44):

All of that, whether or not you’re treating trauma, reminiscence or attachment that’s gotten, it’s, I’m simply picturing like a rug that received all bunched up and Proper. It’s not, it’s not clean, whether or not you’re treating any of these various things, the, the first final result is a way of safety, a way of security within the self, a way of self that’s mm-hmm . Secure and complete and, and sufficient, proper. For thus many people who, who, , search remedy. One factor that I’ve been studying lots these days, and it’s so unusual as a result of we had been gonna have this dialog and I needed to ask you about it. How do we all know that the remedy that we’re doing is true for us? That’s positively a query. And, and two, like, why is it that there’s a lot remedy that simply doesn’t appear to work, I suppose like, yeah, what’s occurring with that?

Susie Morgan (18:41):

So numerous the explanation why remedy doesn’t work is as a result of it doesn’t truly change the way in which the nervous system is working. And so what you’re doing is you’re utilizing actually what, what might be actually highly effective instruments, but it surely’s extra like manually shifting a automotive quite than having driving an automated, mainly the place you need to use these expertise with a view to shift the mind into that adaptive functioning. So one of many issues that I feel is actually, actually essential for, for EMDR therapists to know the right way to do, and it hasn’t been historically skilled, however is to actually be capable to map out what are the first trauma reminiscence networks, the methods the mind has clustered collectively numerous experiences, after which is working out of those maladaptive beliefs. So that you’ll have that canine chew, however then now mother is, , mother is late selecting you up from daycare, and in some way the mind goes, yep, I’m not secure once more.

(19:44)
Otherwise you stroll by a barking canine, who’s actually scary on the way in which to soccer observe, and the mind goes, yep, not secure once more. After which it, it’s mainly placing all these recollections collectively right into a cluster and saying, right here’s my proof of idea, I’m not secure. After which something that triggers that trauma, reminiscence community, lights up all of that cluster of experiences, after which the nervous system responds to that. So oftentimes a, a shopper who is available in has a number of clusters, so that they have one cluster proving I’m not secure. Perhaps one other cluster saying I’m unlovable, one other cluster saying I don’t belong, or no matter it’s. Like it may be any number of these. And so if we’ve that lay of the land, that may be actually useful for us realizing, okay, this, this, I’m not secure is linked to those panic signs, or this, I’m not lovable, is linked to those attachment type of anxious attachment sort methods, regardless of the case could be.

(20:44)
However then we’ve this different superb reminiscence community that each one of us have. It’s only for a few of us, it’s, it’s extra effectively developed than others. And it’s the adaptive data community. It’s all these experiences of, of, , studying or of being liked or of being restored ultimately, or having, , a way of belonging as a part of a tradition or a part of a, , a part of a non secular observe or a part of a, of a non secular group. These, these finest mates or these, these animals that simply love us it doesn’t matter what. All of that. And I consider these as bushes. So so mainly there’s, there’s one thing that planted the tree when it comes to the, these darkish trauma reminiscence networks. There’s an occasion that planted the tree, after which the tree simply grew up and received larger with all of these different occasions that received clustered collectively.

(21:37)
Nicely, this, this gentle tree, this adaptive data tree of data additionally has, has a method wherein it was planted. That’s that early attachment system. In order that’s the trunk of that tree. And a few individuals have a spindly trunk, which suggests they’re rather more prone to the wind blowing after which being taken off steadiness. After which additionally they can have numerous ranges of levels wherein that adaptive data community has been constructed out by all of those different optimistic and experiences of resilience, experiences of success, experiences of overcoming all that jazz, so, so lengthy method to, to put the muse for the reply to your query is mainly therapies, I feel do considered one of two issues. One is they assist improve that gentle tree of adaptive data. So if you’re studying meditation, if you’re studying how to think about the optimistic, the right way to give attention to what’s true about you, all of that, you’re actually enhancing and specializing in that adaptive data reminiscence community.

(22:45)
And, and so there’s a lot that’s optimistic and highly effective about numerous the therapies on the market that do this. Then there’s one other, type of sort of remedy like cognitive behavioral, the place what it’s doing is it’s, it’s permitting you to problem that activation of that adverse reminiscence community and saying, yeah, however bear in mind it’s not true. And so that you do this, that handbook shifting by way of type of logic your self into the sunshine tree. However that’s actually onerous and may really feel like gaslighting actually, if you’re like, however my nervous system says the trauma is what’s true. Not this different logic stuff that I would know in my head.

Betty Rocker (23:28):

That simply is a part of what I suppose I’ve been listening to from individuals generally once they say, , discuss remedy or sure forms of discuss remedy, I really feel like I’m simply rehashing these uncomfortable issues again and again with out actually getting wherever. I’m simply spinning my wheels.

Susie Morgan (23:41):

That’s one other sort of remedy. So there may be, there are forms of remedy the place the thought is that if we’ve perception or if we discuss sufficient by way of it, then you definitely’ll get higher. So meaning you sit in the dead of night hint, you sit in these trauma reminiscence networks throughout trauma, the, throughout your remedy, and that’s purported to theoretically make you’re feeling higher, but it surely doesn’t truly essentially do this as a result of all you’re doing is type of dwelling within the darkness. And so individuals are like, effectively, I don’t wanna go to my previous. I wanna do these different issues. Nicely, that’s nice. Now all you’re doing is manually shifting into the lightness. So what we’re on the lookout for is one thing that truly reconsolidate the reminiscence truly shifts the, the, the, the training that’s occurred within the nervous system. And EMDR is just not the one present on the town that may do this. There are different therapies that truly might be efficient with reminiscence. Reconsolidation, EMDR remedy is only one the place we do get constant outcomes with that when it’s completed correctly. And in order that’s, yeah.

Betty Rocker (24:42):

That’s, that’s the R and the EMDR, the reprocessing half. Sure. Yeah, that’s the place the combination occurs. So I’ll share somewhat bit, that, , however my listeners don’t. Once I first began doing EMDR remedy with Susie, it’s been a number of years now since we did this nice work collectively, and we spent a few years doing it. I bear in mind to start with I used to be like, effectively, when are we, when will we get to do the EMDR? Like, when are we gonna get to that half? And what was actually superb is her strategy was so considerate. She was, she went in and realized the place now I do know the lingo, after all I didn’t on the time, my clusters, she was on the lookout for the place are the, the networks right here that I have to work with. She deliberately realized the panorama of this thoughts that she was then going to be going into with like her positive devices and serving to to reprocess.

(25:38)
Proper? So like, that was such an essential a part of that work. I feel that, that when you don’t learn about it, you, you don’t know what you don’t know, proper? However I feel it’s so essential. And there’ve been, and there have been additionally issues that you just did to start with that I’ve by no means forgotten. You gave me instruments. I bear in mind among the superb instruments that you just gave me to assist me have a way of safety, to have a way of security. After which after all, the precise observe of EMDR, which is so superb. It’s so tough to do the work generally, but it surely’s additionally so essential. It’s like, , you guys, like if you do a extremely robust exercise, , such as you gotta put within the work to get the consequence. However it felt like there was a real final result coming at the same time as I used to be going by way of the tough facets of it.

(26:26)
And it, it, I used to attempt to clarify what it was love to do, to be an a, a affected person going by way of E-M-D-R, when you guys have seen the film “Inside Out,” that is like the easiest way that I can clarify it. There’s this place that, that they go what’s, which is just like the reminiscence financial institution, and it’s all of those glowing balls of sunshine that they’ve simply stacked up and stacked up and stacked up. And so I all the time pictured just like the trauma recollections as like these like gnarly black balls of sunshine that, that had been like saved within the reminiscence financial institution, that, that had been truly infecting all the opposite recollections. As a result of that’s what occurs together with your, with the issues which are what we name maladaptive. Appropriate. Is that proper terminology? Yeah. So the maladaptive recollections that didn’t truly get processed appropriately to start with, these are like now infecting the remainder of your recollections.

(27:14)
And so you might have these reactions to issues that you would be able to’t actually management. It’s like bugs in your working system if you would like like a pc terminology for it. And it was like going by way of doing the work of the EMDR, you’re like altering the material again to one thing clean. We will return to that rug instance the place the rug was all bunched up and we’re like smoothing out the rug. And now when one thing comes up that was once an actual set off or one thing that might, you’d have like this unavoidable response that you just had no management over, it’s now not there, it’s simply not even a set off. You continue to have the reminiscence of the factor, but it surely’s not lit up anymore. And I feel that was so profound for me of just like the expertise of EMDR, of like how a lot it modified the material of my precise being.

(27:58)
Like I felt like I turned just like the model of myself. I used to be all the time meant to be by way of going by way of that work. And so it makes numerous sense. This care that’s taken all through the method, particularly to start with, as a result of I’ve had mates inform me – oh why, when – I’ve despatched mates to EMDR they usually’re like why when do I get to do the EMDR? I’m like, let your therapist do these actually essential items in the beginning as a result of they’ll aid you get a greater lead to the long run. So I feel it’s fascinating the way it

Susie Morgan (28:32):

Works. There’s so many items that you just simply mentioned which are so essential that I wanna nearly give the again of the home understanding of a bit. Please, please. The, the why. In order that unique query you requested of like, effectively, how have you learnt when you’re in the proper place together with your therapist? Yeah. And I feel there’s that bigger query of like, are you doing a remedy that truly modifications the way in which the nervous system is holding the recollections? And, so that you’re re transforming that complete factor so that you routinely reply in another way. It’s not that handbook management, however if you’re searching for out an EMDR therapist, whether or not or not they take this, this primary like part of the work actually significantly is a extremely massive element for deciding whether or not or not you’re in the proper place.

Betty Rocker (29:22):

Mm.

Susie Morgan (29:22):

And oftentimes, this isn’t the fault of the therapist, it’s the fault of the way it’s historically been skilled the place actually it’s such as you do type of like this, this fast, this fast intro and then you definitely simply bounce into, to processing trauma recollections. However that’s the place we’ve individuals having actually dangerous experiences. And the primary purpose is as a result of individuals, individuals aren’t essentially prepared for that but. And or the, the therapist doesn’t essentially have the, the readiness of getting an excellent therapy plan in place with a view to know why we’re gonna begin right here and go there and go there. And so after I was doing all of these early, type of items of labor with you, it’s, it’s truly there, it’s twofold. One is, I truly, I’m, I’m purposefully mapping, I’m purposefully providing you with instruments that matter in your expertise of being within the work, however I’m additionally awaiting very, very key facets that point out your mind is prepared to do that, that your nervous system can do sure issues.

(30:28)
And so every part I’m doing has a twin function. It’s each getting you prepared, constructing that readiness if I have to do extra of one thing, but in addition seeing what’s there and seeing whether or not or not that that extra type of prep work is prepared. After which the opposite piece, and that is, that is simply because I wish to point out it, that piece about that grownup, like strongest wisest self being there for little you, that’s the core key characteristic to attachment restore. It’s creating out that grownup self to present little you what nobody else has been in a position to give us totally and to attract from the fashions of those that have perhaps in items and issues like that. However finally, repairing the attachment system is realizing deep down that you just’ve received you and that you just’ve

Betty Rocker (31:19):

Acquired you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That’s so Nicely, that’s so effectively mentioned. And, and this work is so profound as a result of I feel, our tradition is just not alone in being one which has numerous addictive compulsive sort of points, but it surely definitely has so many, and, and I feel this should be one thing that presents in, in your observe so usually is dependancy sort of labor. Mm-hmm . Like so many individuals, I imply, we’ve dependancy to buying, to alcohol, to medicine, to intercourse, to, how, I don’t know, so many various issues. So I might think about that EMDR is actually helpful in supporting the discount of addictive habits. And and the way does it do this particularly? I,

Susie Morgan (32:07):

Nicely, probably the most latest type of essential items of type of connecting the dots that’s been made got here by way of the ACEs research. And I’m unsure when you or your listeners are aware of it, but it surely’s the opposed Childhood Experiences research. And like EMDR, it’s truly been round for nearly as a lot time, but it surely didn’t actually get any press till extra not too long ago. However it’s a very primary research that has simply been completed on monumental hoards of individuals at this level. And it’s even, replicated by the, the CDC at this level. So we’re in a position to see it’s true throughout populations that early childhood opposed experiences, even when they occur simply as soon as, they create a vulnerability within the nervous system to develop psychological well being points, to develop bodily well being points and to develop addictions. And so, and it’s exponentially extra highly effective than anybody would ever assume.

(33:03)
And so addictions is one thing that we very a lot can see. Early childhood trauma actually potentiates that vulnerability to dependancy later. And what’s attention-grabbing when it comes to EMDR remedy and trauma reminiscence networks and all of that’s this concept that dependancy has actually two elements which are occurring with reminiscence networks. One is the trauma is a driver, in order that that ache goes to drive you to the factor that eases the ache. The opposite factor although, is the pull of the dependancy. And you may even have maladaptively linked optimistic recollections which are the, the important thing to the mind persevering with to hunt the excessive or the necessity being met by this addictive habits or substance, even when there’s tons and tons of penalties, or when you by no means obtain that prime to that diploma. Once more,

Betty Rocker (33:58):

I nearly perceive what you imply by optimistic maladaptive. It’s nearly prefer it, are you able to simply make clear that somewhat bit extra? Yeah,

Susie Morgan (34:06):

Yeah, completely. So the instance I realized from the one that I first realized this from, was an instance of the, , a somewhat, somewhat boy who had an abusive father. And his dad was actually, actually into enjoying playing cards, was actually into poker. And and in a while, this man has now’s now presenting in remedy as a result of he has a playing dependancy. He’s misplaced his home, he’s misplaced his household, he’s misplaced every part. So we’re gonna assume, okay, effectively, he realized about, he realized about playing from little, in order that’s simply what he grew as much as do, proper? Like, it’s that easy, but it surely’s not, the place it truly solidified in his mind was, so bear in mind he has this trauma of neglect and, and abuse from his dad. Nicely, sooner or later, , one of many guys isn’t there for the poker sport. So dad invitations his son to the poker desk that’s the place his mind swiftly felt liked. His mind swiftly felt seen and included and seen by his dad. And fireworks go off within the mind. And it’s like that soldering of one thing the place it’s identical to, Ooh, poker equals I’m liked, I’m lovable. And so from then on, doesn’t matter how a lot he loses, doesn’t matter all the implications, the mind doesn’t even like take note of any of that information. It’s coming, but it surely doesn’t matter. He retains searching for that must be met on the poker desk at no matter value.

Betty Rocker (35:45):

Acquired it. Acquired it. That’s an excellent instance, proper? That made a lot sense. You’ll be able to see how addictions can type of so many differing types due to the complexity of that layer, these layers collectively. Like that’s, and that should be very onerous to unwind for individuals due to what a strong urge that’s, like at a deep core degree to be liked, to be belong. These are deep human wants that all of us have, and once they’re not met, once we’re youthful, after which they’ve these layers on prime of them, and we’re simply on the market making an attempt to be grownups, coping with life and all of our many obligations and, and repeating outdated patterns again and again and never understanding why, for example. So who wants EMDR? Who can be an excellent candidate for EMDR, would you say? I imply, we’ve talked about numerous issues, however I feel lots of people listening are figuring out sure issues in what we’re speaking about. So let’s simply make it plain and easy. Like who can be an excellent candidate?

Susie Morgan (36:46):

I suppose there’s somebody on the market who wouldn’t, however I haven’t met them. And, I imply, there are these individuals who actually grew up with that actually strong early attachment expertise. Their wants had been met. And, and I’ve seen these purchasers are available as a result of that they had one single actually dangerous t like massive T trauma, and but their stuff resolves like that. Like that’s the place you see this like magic occur. Prefer it’s, it may be a matter of two periods and one thing horrific, identical to is is totally reprocessed by the nervous system

Betty Rocker (37:24):

As a result of they’ve a sturdy and safe attachment fashion and safety in themselves to start out with. Their basis is, is actually robust. After which from there, therapeutic is simpler, I suppose you’d say, proper?

Susie Morgan (37:37):

Sure. In order that they’re confronted with traumas, they’re confronted with various things, and their mind is like, oh, I’ve received this. And it, and it, it, , it takes that, that adaptive data reminiscence community and simply wraps it round and it’s identical to, yep. Like I realized from that. Now it’s over and off you go. Hmm. So there are individuals on the market who’re like that, they’re simply extra uncommon.

(38:00)
Hmm. The remainder of us , and I say that together with myself, have much more vulnerability to those various things. And so when somebody is saying, , I’ve simply all the time been anxious, or I’ve simply all the time had these bouts of despair, that type of factor, or this self-doubt, this self-confidence problem the place I’m not reaching for that subsequent degree at work, or I’m not stepping out of, , like I, I do know I ought to be capable to do that, however I, however I’m, I’m stopping myself. I’m, I’m insecure, or I’m, , repeating these relationship patterns or that type of factor. Mm-hmm. All of this stuff are issues that make you an excellent candidate to step into an EMDR therapist’s workplace. Mm mm Then the distinction is whether or not or not that EMDR therapist has eyes to see the right way to deal with you. Have they completed adequate coaching in having the ability to actually, actually like, have that curiosity to, to have a look at what, what’s all this related to? The place did this, this studying happen that’s now left you in a sample of, , responding on this method? What are all these reminiscence networks? And is your mind able to do the precise trauma reminiscence reprocessing, or do we have to do a bunch of fro entrance loading in order that we are able to get there? It’s oftentimes not the case that somebody can’t do EMDR remedy. It simply means somebody may have to do some extra refined issues to get their mind prepared for it.

Betty Rocker (39:30):

You could have some fairly superb sources for individuals at totally different ranges in the case of EMDR. One factor that you’ve got is, I bear in mind the EMDR readiness course, which helps individuals like me determine whether or not we’re prepared or how, clarify that for me, when you don’t thoughts.

Susie Morgan (39:50):

So this course has been round for numerous years, and it’s truly, I might attribute, the triggering of making that course to you truly, oh, cease . As a result of sooner or later you sat down with me and also you mentioned, Susie, I’m referring individuals out to EMDR remedy on a regular basis now, they usually’re not getting, from their remedy course of what I’m getting with you. And at that time, it brought on me to self-reflect and say, am I truly doing one thing in another way? Hmm. And, and I discovered I used to be, and it wasn’t simply because I’m good, it was often because I used to be actually hungry to be taught and insecure. Truly, my very own insecurities had been in there the place I used to be like, I have to be taught extra, I have to be taught extra. I have to be taught extra. So I had, I had gone to so many various trainings by so many various specialists within the area, however then my, my energy actually is synthesizing issues collectively, curating and synthesizing these supplies right into a system primarily.

(40:48)
And so through the years, there’s been a technique that I’ve developed that began with that course and actually beginning to actually like, type of, conceptualize it and make it extra concrete that’s now developed out into some broader coaching applications that I can clarify. However, however the readiness course continues to be obtainable. It’s one thing that you are able to do by yourself. It’s nearly like a, a digital like workbook. And it takes you thru the readiness course of. So numerous the steps that you just and I did collectively when it comes to these, these instruments and people, these expertise that you just developed in the beginning, beginning to actually map out these trauma reminiscence networks as a way to actually do some work by yourself and determine does this EMDR remedy factor is smart for me? Hmm. The opposite factor is that may be completed alongside a therapist, of their course of with you.

(41:40)
For lots of people, it’s actually useful to have the assist of a therapist whereas they’re doing these processes. And the primary module of that course says takes you thru some questionnaire that say like, ought to, do you have to do that alone or not? Hmm. And so it, it may aid you assume by way of that course of. The opposite factor that’s now obtainable, that’s additionally on the self-help web page of my web site, which is precisionemdr.com. So when you go to the self-help web page, you’ll see two various things. One is that readiness course, however one can also be a free 45 minute course that truly explains this, this tree idea that we’ve been speaking about. Cool. So that you’re in a position to visualize the trauma reminiscence networks, that adaptive data gentle tree of data, in order that when you begin EMDR remedy, you’re getting into actually understanding that complete formulation of it. And it goes extra into what processing appears to be like like, that type of factor and what’s occurring within the mind throughout that. So, so that’s free to simply check out, there’s, no strings. Yeah.

Betty Rocker (42:45):

That’s a tremendous present. And what a tremendous useful resource as effectively. After which I feel you’re additionally now, such as you’ve mentioned, you’ve developed your methodology, you’re now coaching different therapists at totally different, totally different ranges from the graduate degree to all the way in which to individuals who’ve been training for a very long time. Is that what you had been telling me? That’s superb. What, what does that contain?

Susie Morgan (43:08):

So there’s two main items. One is we’ve an EMDRIA permitted primary coaching, which they’re the bigwigs. They, they, they take you thru a reasonably rigorous course of if you’re creating a program to say, does it, , verify all of the bins. And so we checked all of the bins and what was actually thrilling is, I used to be permitted to have the ability to, to actually use all of this readiness and the goal sequencing, which is the, the why you do, which, which trauma reminiscence first, that type of factor. In addition to all of those attachment items into our primary coaching program. After which we’ve additionally a complicated a set of programs. So it’s truly a complete of 33 hours, half one and half two. However half one truly goes by way of all of this readiness and, and fills within the gaps of what hasn’t been there in numerous that conventional coaching that the majority therapists have gone by way of. After which half two goes into all of this fancy footwork round how will we restore the attachment system? How will we tackle these addictions? And that sparkle that these maladaptively linked recollections can have and all of that. So it’s, it’s a extremely strong superior course that individuals can undergo

Betty Rocker (44:20):

A lot to know, so essential to be a well-trained practitioner and for us as individuals searching for remedy to know as a lot as we are able to about this in order that we are able to go into it eyes open, searching for this care. And likewise, , discern being discerning, I suppose, about what we’re gonna obtain. I feel that’s, that’s so essential. Nicely, you’ve shared your, web site with us and we are able to additionally comply with you on social media, appropriate. Wanna say your, your deal with,

Susie Morgan (44:55):

It’s @PrecisionEMDR. So it’s precisionEMDR all over the place. So whether or not that’s the web site or the deal with on Instagram or Fb, that’s, that’s the place yow will discover me and discover out what we’re doing. ’trigger I, it’s not simply me, however I even have gathered an exceptional group of specialists. It’s truly one of many distinctive items of our program is everybody who’s a guide on our coaching group is an professional in EMDR, in addition to oftentimes a specialty space or integration with one other therapy mannequin. So, so we are able to all be discovered there and it’s, it’s actually hopefully going to be an increasing number of a sturdy useful resource for referral sources and all of that for individuals all around the, all around the nation. As a result of we’ve people who find themselves going by way of our trainings who’re from far and wide.

Betty Rocker (45:42):

That’s great and great to consider all the people who find themselves doubtlessly searching for EMDR or perhaps didn’t know the way helpful EMDR could possibly be for them. And now we’ll have an extra useful resource to return to for details about it, for searching for a practitioner for it, or practitioner searching for extra coaching for it. It’s actually great what you’re creating. And thanks for all of the work that you just do on this world to make it a greater place. We respect you a lot. So thanks. Thanks a lot for approaching and speaking to us immediately and sharing all of this actually invaluable data and insights. And thanks for every part you’ve completed for me as effectively. Like, I might not be this model of the Betty Rocker with out you and your entire nice work. So all of you guys listening, I’m so glad that you just had an opportunity to satisfy Susie, ’trigger she’s simply unbelievable and I hope you look her up and search for her work. And Susie, is there any, like, final phrases, something you wanna go away with us that I didn’t ask or something you wanna say?

Susie Morgan (46:37):

Actually, it’s simply wanting to specific my gratefulness for the chance to return in right here and discuss this and, and the, the, the platform that you’re utilizing throughout the board to assist, particularly ladies of their well being on all facets of issues. And EMDR is one thing that, such as you mentioned, it’s a buzzword on the market. Individuals discuss it, however they oftentimes don’t know sufficient about it to know the way it might truly connect with them, the way it might truly be, actually perhaps much more powerfully completed if it’s one thing that that they had a, , eh, expertise with earlier than. Issues like that. So I’m simply actually grateful that this was essential to you to do and, and simply thanks for having me.

Betty Rocker (47:22):

Yay. Nicely, we look ahead to speaking to you once more very quickly. And, thanks guys a lot for listening. Yow will discover all the hyperlinks and sources over on the present notes web page for this podcast episode, in addition to Susie’s hyperlinks that she’s already shared. So look ahead to speaking to you once more. Until subsequent time, I’m Betty Rocker, and you’re so superior, so flawsome and superb.